Discussion:
Have any heat against inmates?
(too old to reply)
Chris Assaf
2003-08-23 22:52:33 UTC
Permalink
Well, then, post them here. Tell me your opinions on inmates. Let teh
bashing commence.
Stewart Connor
2003-08-24 02:02:03 UTC
Permalink
hole
Lefty
2003-08-24 03:52:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Assaf
Well, then, post them here. Tell me your opinions on inmates. Let teh
bashing commence.
I've always hated them.

Fuck the inmates.
aka MAX
2003-08-24 16:37:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Assaf
Well, then, post them here. Tell me your opinions on inmates. Let
teh
Post by Chris Assaf
bashing commence.
Since they are people, some are worthless, some are able to get their
shit together and become useful to themselves and society.
Ken
Like that definition "they are people". It does serve to remind us ALL that
they are humans and as such are part of this big tribe that suufers to
remain intact in a world of predators evolving to drive us to
extinction......that lovely woman at Avila Beach is just a tiny example.

Lots of Love
DON
AKAMAX
rl
2003-08-25 00:35:13 UTC
Permalink
You gonna force them to go to school, Dave?

You can pass all the laws you want, and require me to set them in a
classroom - even to use force if necessary to hold them there.

But you can't force them to learn anything.

Every time I've stopped in and did a security check on one of our GED
classrooms I have to shake my head in utter disbelief. I've seen 7th
graders more attentive - not to mention show better manners.

The ones who actually want to get out of prison better than who they were
than they came in don't need society to pass laws forcing them to get their
GED. All your "mandatory GED" laws do is clutter up the class with flotsam
who detract from the teachers ability to teach the students who really want
to be there.
I've read on average it costs 26,000 dollars per year each, to keep them
behind bars. It would be nice if they could come out of prison with at
least a high school diploma and a trade and maybe knowledge of enough
social and life skills that would help them avoid going back to prison.
Post by Chris Assaf
Well, then, post them here. Tell me your opinions on inmates. Let teh
bashing commence.
Ring Toss Dave
2003-08-25 12:51:23 UTC
Permalink
Well, if the system isn't working so well the way it is, maybe some changes
are in order? What would you suggest?
Post by rl
You gonna force them to go to school, Dave?
You can pass all the laws you want, and require me to set them in a
classroom - even to use force if necessary to hold them there.
But you can't force them to learn anything.
Every time I've stopped in and did a security check on one of our GED
classrooms I have to shake my head in utter disbelief. I've seen 7th
graders more attentive - not to mention show better manners.
The ones who actually want to get out of prison better than who they were
than they came in don't need society to pass laws forcing them to get their
GED. All your "mandatory GED" laws do is clutter up the class with flotsam
who detract from the teachers ability to teach the students who really want
to be there.
I've read on average it costs 26,000 dollars per year each, to keep them
behind bars. It would be nice if they could come out of prison with at
least a high school diploma and a trade and maybe knowledge of enough
social and life skills that would help them avoid going back to prison.
Post by Chris Assaf
Well, then, post them here. Tell me your opinions on inmates. Let teh
bashing commence.
Napalm Heart
2003-08-25 17:59:28 UTC
Permalink
The desire to learn and better themselves has to pretty much come from
within. You can try to coerce them by making it a requirement of
parole, but that still only works on those who care enough about their
future to get educated. First, they have to want to live life legally
and not look at doing time as just a cost of doing business. rl's
right in what he says here.

Ken (MI)
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Well, if the system isn't working so well the way it is, maybe some changes
are in order? What would you suggest?
Post by rl
You gonna force them to go to school, Dave?
You can pass all the laws you want, and require me to set them in a
classroom - even to use force if necessary to hold them there.
But you can't force them to learn anything.
Every time I've stopped in and did a security check on one of our GED
classrooms I have to shake my head in utter disbelief. I've seen 7th
graders more attentive - not to mention show better manners.
The ones who actually want to get out of prison better than who they were
than they came in don't need society to pass laws forcing them to get their
GED. All your "mandatory GED" laws do is clutter up the class with flotsam
who detract from the teachers ability to teach the students who really want
to be there.
I've read on average it costs 26,000 dollars per year each, to keep them
behind bars. It would be nice if they could come out of prison with at
least a high school diploma and a trade and maybe knowledge of enough
social and life skills that would help them avoid going back to prison.
Post by Chris Assaf
Well, then, post them here. Tell me your opinions on inmates. Let teh
bashing commence.
aka MAX
2003-08-25 19:15:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Napalm Heart
The desire to learn and better themselves has to pretty much come from
within. You can try to coerce them by making it a requirement of
parole, but that still only works on those who care enough about their
future to get educated. First, they have to want to live life legally
and not look at doing time as just a cost of doing business. rl's
right in what he says here.
Ken (MI)
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Well, if the system isn't working so well the way it is, maybe
some changes
Post by Ring Toss Dave
are in order? What would you suggest?
Post by rl
You gonna force them to go to school, Dave?
You can pass all the laws you want, and require me to set them in
a
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
classroom - even to use force if necessary to hold them there.
But you can't force them to learn anything.
Every time I've stopped in and did a security check on one of our
GED
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
classrooms I have to shake my head in utter disbelief. I've seen
7th
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
graders more attentive - not to mention show better manners.
The ones who actually want to get out of prison better than who
they were
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
than they came in don't need society to pass laws forcing them to
get their
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
GED. All your "mandatory GED" laws do is clutter up the class
with flotsam
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
who detract from the teachers ability to teach the students who
really want
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
to be there.
I've read on average it costs 26,000 dollars per year each, to
keep them
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
behind bars. It would be nice if they could come out of prison
with at
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
least a high school diploma and a trade and maybe knowledge of
enough
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
social and life skills that would help them avoid going back to
prison.
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
Post by Chris Assaf
Well, then, post them here. Tell me your opinions on inmates.
Let teh
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
Post by Chris Assaf
bashing commence.
The desire to learn and better themselves has to pretty much come from
within. You can try to coerce them by making it a requirement of
parole, but that still only works on those who care enough about their
future to get educated. First, they have to want to live life legally
and not look at doing time as just a cost of doing business. rl's
right in what he says here.
Ken (MI)
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Well, if the system isn't working so well the way it is, maybe
some changes
Post by Ring Toss Dave
are in order? What would you suggest?
Post by rl
You gonna force them to go to school, Dave?
You can pass all the laws you want, and require me to set them in
a
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
classroom - even to use force if necessary to hold them there.
But you can't force them to learn anything.
Every time I've stopped in and did a security check on one of our
GED
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
classrooms I have to shake my head in utter disbelief. I've seen
7th
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
graders more attentive - not to mention show better manners.
The ones who actually want to get out of prison better than who
they were
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
than they came in don't need society to pass laws forcing them to
get their
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
GED. All your "mandatory GED" laws do is clutter up the class
with flotsam
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
who detract from the teachers ability to teach the students who
really want
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
to be there.
I've read on average it costs 26,000 dollars per year each, to
keep them
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
behind bars. It would be nice if they could come out of prison
with at
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
least a high school diploma and a trade and maybe knowledge of
enough
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
social and life skills that would help them avoid going back to
prison.
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
Post by Chris Assaf
Well, then, post them here. Tell me your opinions on inmates.
Let teh
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
Post by Chris Assaf
bashing commence.
Seems a whole lot of folks here seem to poo poo coaching, inspiration,
building up a belief in one's self when all they may have experianced is put
downs, etc. Of course one needs to at least have faith that trying will
bear fruit. Building up anohther's self confidence s not as degrading an
occupation as many here deem it to be. It's like I have often responded to
those that say you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make them drink.
All too often, expecially in areas where the students are being herded
rather than led, the water holes they have been led to are dry.
How many time do I have to tell folks MY rehabilitation was based on others
that allowed me to believe IT COULD BE DONE. Two were COs that had
confidence in my potential, another was a Cop and of course the woman who
married me, my Mom and my new Step father...let alone folks that gave me a
job and allowed me to promote and prosper even after they knew I was an
ex-con.
Waiting for someone to overcome a background of abuse, distrust in athority,
and the myriad of incidents that creat REASONS (not excuses) for an
inability to cope without attacking that weakness is a cop out.
I know, you'll get a check anyway.

Lots of Love
Don
AKA MAX
.
D E M I G O D
2003-08-26 22:42:57 UTC
Permalink
Max, I won't ask you to rephrase you nonsense... Because after
editing, it will be even more nonsensical and incomprehensible.
--


This was your desire. And here I am now, always to be with you
as a worst nightmare. Because I will hold YOU to the contract of
your choice, which you coerced me to sign, but unwilling to keep.

DEMIGOD
Post by aka MAX
Building up anohther's self confidence s not as degrading an
occupation as many here deem it to be. It's like I have often
responded to those that say you can lead a horse to water but
you cannot make them drink.
............. the students are being herded rather than led,
the water holes they have been led to are dry.
How many time do I have to tell folks MY rehabilitation was based
on others that allowed me to believe IT COULD BE DONE. Two
were COs that had confidence in my potential, another was a Cop
rl
2003-08-26 00:18:31 UTC
Permalink
There's no doubt the system does not work, Dave.

You don't need a PhD in advanced Mathematics to see we aren't "fixing"
anything with prison. And to be frank about it (and contrary to what Don
may profess - "all we need to do is build up their self confidence") I don't
think the problem can be solved inside the "system" unless the inmate comes
to us with a basic foundation.

I think in order to be able to "rehabilitate" anyone, they have to have some
core fundamentals that are simply non existent in much of modern American
society. For example:
1) You have to have been taught the Golden Rule.
2) You have to know at a fundamental level the difference between Right and
Wrong.
3) You have to have a Mom and a Dad - or at least people who stood in for
those roles as you were growing up.
4) You have to know you will be punished - disciplined - for inappropriate
behavior.
5) You have to have faced some positive challenges in your life and
succeeded.
6) You have to be able to imagine yourself in a better place than you are
in now - and have the ability to formulate a plan on how to get there.
7) You have to have better things to do with your time than sitting on a
Nintendo or Play Station 6 hours per day.
8) You have to know what hard physical labor feels like.
9) You had to have chores and responsibilities assigned to you as you were
growing up.

etc. etc.

Wow! I could go on and on. These fundamentals are missing in one huge
percentage of the young men we are seeing incarcerated nowadays. If a guy
has these basics, I can probably agree he made a mistake in life and can be
turned around to be productive again. But if he doesn't - sorry, forget
it.....more than likely you're wasting your time with him.

Kinda bleak and grim, I agree. But I think its reality.
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Well, if the system isn't working so well the way it is, maybe some changes
are in order? What would you suggest?
Post by rl
You gonna force them to go to school, Dave?
You can pass all the laws you want, and require me to set them in a
classroom - even to use force if necessary to hold them there.
But you can't force them to learn anything.
Every time I've stopped in and did a security check on one of our GED
classrooms I have to shake my head in utter disbelief. I've seen 7th
graders more attentive - not to mention show better manners.
The ones who actually want to get out of prison better than who they were
than they came in don't need society to pass laws forcing them to get their
GED. All your "mandatory GED" laws do is clutter up the class with flotsam
who detract from the teachers ability to teach the students who really want
to be there.
I've read on average it costs 26,000 dollars per year each, to keep them
behind bars. It would be nice if they could come out of prison with at
least a high school diploma and a trade and maybe knowledge of enough
social and life skills that would help them avoid going back to prison.
Post by Chris Assaf
Well, then, post them here. Tell me your opinions on inmates. Let teh
bashing commence.
Bru
2003-08-26 05:49:05 UTC
Permalink
Here Here!!!! Too many folks these days think and/or feel that everyone
else OWES them.

You can't take someone who is convinced in his heart that the world owes
him, that Playstations are the way to spend his time (stoned playing GTA3)
that taking an low paying menial job is more humiliating than sucking off
his ol ladies welfare check, that education is over rated and convince him
that the only one who owes him IS him, that hard honest work is never
demeaning, that education even if only for ones own satisfaction is always a
worthwhile goal.
Post by rl
There's no doubt the system does not work, Dave.
You don't need a PhD in advanced Mathematics to see we aren't "fixing"
anything with prison. And to be frank about it (and contrary to what Don
may profess - "all we need to do is build up their self confidence") I don't
think the problem can be solved inside the "system" unless the inmate comes
to us with a basic foundation.
I think in order to be able to "rehabilitate" anyone, they have to have some
core fundamentals that are simply non existent in much of modern American
1) You have to have been taught the Golden Rule.
2) You have to know at a fundamental level the difference between Right and
Wrong.
3) You have to have a Mom and a Dad - or at least people who stood in for
those roles as you were growing up.
4) You have to know you will be punished - disciplined - for
inappropriate
Post by rl
behavior.
5) You have to have faced some positive challenges in your life and
succeeded.
6) You have to be able to imagine yourself in a better place than you are
in now - and have the ability to formulate a plan on how to get there.
7) You have to have better things to do with your time than sitting on a
Nintendo or Play Station 6 hours per day.
8) You have to know what hard physical labor feels like.
9) You had to have chores and responsibilities assigned to you as you were
growing up.
etc. etc.
Wow! I could go on and on. These fundamentals are missing in one huge
percentage of the young men we are seeing incarcerated nowadays. If a guy
has these basics, I can probably agree he made a mistake in life and can be
turned around to be productive again. But if he doesn't - sorry, forget
it.....more than likely you're wasting your time with him.
Kinda bleak and grim, I agree. But I think its reality.
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Well, if the system isn't working so well the way it is, maybe some
changes
Post by Ring Toss Dave
are in order? What would you suggest?
Post by rl
You gonna force them to go to school, Dave?
You can pass all the laws you want, and require me to set them in a
classroom - even to use force if necessary to hold them there.
But you can't force them to learn anything.
Every time I've stopped in and did a security check on one of our GED
classrooms I have to shake my head in utter disbelief. I've seen 7th
graders more attentive - not to mention show better manners.
The ones who actually want to get out of prison better than who they
were
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
than they came in don't need society to pass laws forcing them to get
their
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
GED. All your "mandatory GED" laws do is clutter up the class with
flotsam
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
who detract from the teachers ability to teach the students who really
want
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
to be there.
I've read on average it costs 26,000 dollars per year each, to keep
them
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
behind bars. It would be nice if they could come out of prison with
at
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
least a high school diploma and a trade and maybe knowledge of enough
social and life skills that would help them avoid going back to
prison.
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
Post by Chris Assaf
Well, then, post them here. Tell me your opinions on inmates. Let
teh
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
Post by Chris Assaf
bashing commence.
rl
2003-08-27 01:37:03 UTC
Permalink
Yeah, I know Lefty.

You were just a deprived victim of society with nowhere to go but down the
sewer.

Its everyone's fault but yours.
You dont really need any of that stuff. All you need is the belief that
somewhere along the line you'll get a fair shake, and nobody really
believes
that because it aint really true anyway.
The convicts you complain about are also the result of living in a
society/economy based on pure pyramid theory. The guy at the top gets
filthy
rich, and then makes a run for it. Everybody else lower down the totem
pole
gets fucked to various degrees, increasing as you go downward.
Do you think that large numbers of people who live in abject poverty, with
no hope of justice or representation, with only the hope of crappy jobs, a
future of glorious serfdom, - do you think that they will all just swallow
that sitting down ? I dont think so. What we see are people who are voting
bodily against the current caste system which is being thrust upon them.
Yes, there are many who have no excuse for their specific behaviours, but
you cant pluck these things from the larger picture which is driving the
whole crime wave.
You're list of requisites left out one big X-factor - and that is the
willingness of society to accept an ex-con back into society, to give a
man
a job, to leave a motherfucker alone to live in peace when his sentence is
finished. But folks just wont do that so simple, they will deprive you of
even basic jobs, they will picket your house or deny you housing
altogether,
maybe assasinate you, and then sit around blabbering about recidivism and
evildoers.
Hogwash.
And how do you know that you dont need a PhD in advanced Mathematics
anyway
? Something wrong with that too ?
Post by rl
There's no doubt the system does not work, Dave.
You don't need a PhD in advanced Mathematics to see we aren't "fixing"
anything with prison. And to be frank about it (and contrary to what Don
may profess - "all we need to do is build up their self confidence") I
don't
Post by rl
think the problem can be solved inside the "system" unless the inmate
comes
Post by rl
to us with a basic foundation.
I think in order to be able to "rehabilitate" anyone, they have to have
some
Post by rl
core fundamentals that are simply non existent in much of modern American
1) You have to have been taught the Golden Rule.
2) You have to know at a fundamental level the difference between Right
and
Post by rl
Wrong.
3) You have to have a Mom and a Dad - or at least people who stood in for
those roles as you were growing up.
4) You have to know you will be punished - disciplined - for
inappropriate
Post by rl
behavior.
5) You have to have faced some positive challenges in your life and
succeeded.
6) You have to be able to imagine yourself in a better place than you are
in now - and have the ability to formulate a plan on how to get there.
7) You have to have better things to do with your time than sitting on a
Nintendo or Play Station 6 hours per day.
8) You have to know what hard physical labor feels like.
9) You had to have chores and responsibilities assigned to you as you
were
Post by rl
growing up.
etc. etc.
Wow! I could go on and on. These fundamentals are missing in one huge
percentage of the young men we are seeing incarcerated nowadays. If a guy
has these basics, I can probably agree he made a mistake in life and can
be
Post by rl
turned around to be productive again. But if he doesn't - sorry, forget
it.....more than likely you're wasting your time with him.
Kinda bleak and grim, I agree. But I think its reality.
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Well, if the system isn't working so well the way it is, maybe some
changes
Post by Ring Toss Dave
are in order? What would you suggest?
Post by rl
You gonna force them to go to school, Dave?
You can pass all the laws you want, and require me to set them in a
classroom - even to use force if necessary to hold them there.
But you can't force them to learn anything.
Every time I've stopped in and did a security check on one of our GED
classrooms I have to shake my head in utter disbelief. I've seen 7th
graders more attentive - not to mention show better manners.
The ones who actually want to get out of prison better than who they
were
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
than they came in don't need society to pass laws forcing them to
get
Post by rl
their
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
GED. All your "mandatory GED" laws do is clutter up the class with
flotsam
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
who detract from the teachers ability to teach the students who
really
Post by rl
want
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
to be there.
I've read on average it costs 26,000 dollars per year each, to
keep
Post by rl
them
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
behind bars. It would be nice if they could come out of prison
with
Post by rl
at
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
least a high school diploma and a trade and maybe knowledge of
enough
Post by rl
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
social and life skills that would help them avoid going back to
prison.
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
Post by Chris Assaf
Well, then, post them here. Tell me your opinions on inmates.
Let
Post by rl
teh
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Post by rl
Post by Chris Assaf
bashing commence.
bob
2003-09-08 03:10:46 UTC
Permalink
I feel that the suicide options should be seriously discussed with all
sexual offenders.
Post by Ring Toss Dave
Well, if the system isn't working so well the way it is, maybe some changes
are in order? What would you suggest?
Post by rl
You gonna force them to go to school, Dave?
You can pass all the laws you want, and require me to set them in a
classroom - even to use force if necessary to hold them there.
But you can't force them to learn anything.
Every time I've stopped in and did a security check on one of our GED
classrooms I have to shake my head in utter disbelief. I've seen 7th
graders more attentive - not to mention show better manners.
The ones who actually want to get out of prison better than who they were
than they came in don't need society to pass laws forcing them to get their
GED. All your "mandatory GED" laws do is clutter up the class with flotsam
who detract from the teachers ability to teach the students who really want
to be there.
I've read on average it costs 26,000 dollars per year each, to keep them
behind bars. It would be nice if they could come out of prison with at
least a high school diploma and a trade and maybe knowledge of enough
social and life skills that would help them avoid going back to prison.
Post by Chris Assaf
Well, then, post them here. Tell me your opinions on inmates. Let teh
bashing commence.
Perry Noid
2003-08-28 04:01:06 UTC
Permalink
I've read on average it costs 26,000 dollars per year each, to keep them
behind bars. It would be nice if they could come out of prison with at
least a high school diploma and a trade and maybe knowledge of enough
social and life skills that would help them avoid going back to prison.
They need to learn disipline and accept what they did was wrong (that it
was their own fault). Without that nothing else they can learn is going
to help very much.
D E M I G O D
2003-08-29 05:35:22 UTC
Permalink
Other than how to live in indignity, and with all sorts of unfairness
and mistreatment, incarceration does not teach individuals to
anything...

Therefore, Dave raised valid point, reminding others that high
monetary cost to society (should be taken in consideration), to
keep people behind bars...

I'd just like to mention that other than annual cost of about 500
billion of dollars, there are emotional damages, associated
with violation of individuals' basic rights to their life, freedom
and dignity in work. You know, no one has any desire to be
"put to sleep" at whim others, along with being unfairly
exploited in capacity of a slave of the incarceration industry.

--


This was your desire. And here I am now, always to be with you
as a worst nightmare. Because I will hold YOU to the contract of
your choice, which you coerced me to sign, but unwilling to keep.

DEMIGOD
Post by Perry Noid
I've read on average it costs 26,000 dollars per year
each, to keep them behind bars.
They need to learn disipline and accept what they did was
wrong (that it was their own fault). Without that nothing else
they can learn is going to help very much.
bob
2003-09-08 03:09:48 UTC
Permalink
I agree with you Davie. Even pedohiles like you make sense sometimes.
I've read on average it costs 26,000 dollars per year each, to keep them
behind bars. It would be nice if they could come out of prison with at
least a high school diploma and a trade and maybe knowledge of enough
social and life skills that would help them avoid going back to prison.
Post by Chris Assaf
Well, then, post them here. Tell me your opinions on inmates. Let teh
bashing commence.
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